Director ANG LEE and producer JAMES SCHAMUS talk about their latest production, BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN, starring Heath Ledger and Jake Gyllenhaal
Words: Will Davis
Q. How did you get involved and what impact did the story have on you?
Ang Lee: It was almost 4 years ago. I read it because James (Schamus) mailed it to me... there was something quite special that made me want to take a look. And I read the short story and got quite choked up. What I read - one of the characters, they've always got Brokeback Mountain : everything is built on that. It strikes me as something quite existentialist. And then... when Ennis (Heath Ledger) takes the shirt out from the closet I got tears in my eyes. It's peculiar because it's realistic of American rural life which you hardly see in a lot of Westerns... I've never seen anything like that. It talked in a way that was quite peculiar. I found it refreshing and mysterious. Great material. But we went ahead and did The Hulk anyway.
After Crouching Tiger I wanted to do something really ambitious and then after that I sort of got what I was wishing for - it provoked a lot of anger and I was exhausted - like the Hulk back to Bruce Banner. And I was very tired. I was feeling absolutely tired. So after Crouching Tiger I'd had enough. And then I asked... how did that movie turn out? I heard somebody and then somebody else was attached to it and she said No, it's not done yet. And I just won't - I didn't want to miss it a second time.
My father - before he passed away - he said go ahead and do another movie because he saw me being depressed and not having anything to do. He never encouraged me to make movies. Even when I got the Oscar he still thinks I should be a teacher or do something real! And I never told him I was gonna do a gay cowboy movie. (laughter) Anyway, that's how it happened and I feel really glad that I caught this beautiful, beautiful writing. And a chance to do it in peace - that was really a healing process for me. I loved making this movie and I think - the results so far, they're responding really great. To me it's a true great American love story. And thanks to James for greenlighting the film.
Q. Was it hard work getting the film made?
James Schamus: We had tried to make this film as independent producers many years ago, back when we first tried to get Ang - and we talked about it then. And at that point there was no one out there - at the studios - willing to greenlight the movie. And fast-forward a couple of years and I had merged my production company into - what was then embarrassingly called - USA Films, which is now Focus Features, and suddenly we were on the other side of the desk, my partner and I. And so I had to face with the horrifying fact that either I was going to greenlight the movie or go down as one of the big hypocrites of independent film history.
Q. Wouldn't any studios make it even if you 'changed' things here and there?
JS: No, none of their notes were interesting at all... I think people knew that if they said anything they might be accused of being homophobic fascist assholes so... they just said no.
Q. What is it that attracts you to want to make a film? What makes an 'Ang Lee Film'?
AL : I don't know when they attract me. I have a gut reaction. I'm willing to be swayed... I always feel like that project belongs to me and it's inside me... and there's usually something mysterious to me - like, why do I like it so much? - I have no relation to it. I can't think of anything that's further away from me than the range-hands in Wyoming , but it spoke to me and I had tears in my eyes - and I'm willing to spend a year or two to find out... So usually something like that. They're Ang Lee films because they're not particularly work-for-hire, they're not... I use genres but the material I work with I have to borrow and come to terms with. In that sense it's me making efforts rather than any conscious decision - I really struggle to find out what it is. Somehow the material chose me... somehow they look like Ang Lee films. I think somebody said they all have repression in there. (laughter)
JS: There's a few things that define the material for Ang. One is something that will suitably scare him. 'Cos otherwise he'll just turn it down because it's not scary enough - or risky enough. You can't - so there's a lot of really great material out there that he's pretty sturdy about actually when you give to him... he puts it in a kind of S and M way of being a slave to the material or whatever but I actually think there is a running theme of a different kind of theme in Ang Lee movies - there's always somebody who's facing a kind of nothingness...
Q. The scenes between Ennis and Jack are very charged. How did you achieve this, plus is it true that Heath nearly broke Jake's nose when he kissed him?
AL : Yep. I encouraged them to do a passionate kiss... You can never kiss a woman that hard so give me the most heroic Western kiss... and they went about it and probably - nearly broke each other's nose. (pause) It's easy enough to crack jokes. Usually I don't talk about it. I don't want to hurt those things. Technically I will rehearse it... it's based on rehearsals and what we talked about. The actors' preparation is pretty standard. And how we nail each character by repeating... how they feel each other, how they feel their space - nature, themselves, whatever - until we can have a take on their character. So we did all of that but the shooting to me needs to be fresh and spontaneous. So I don't talk too much except for technical notes. So they are in a way a lot easier to deal with than weather, location and shoot.
Q. What about the order in which you shot the more intense, sexual scenes - was it chronological?
AL : I wish we could have that freedom to shoot accordingly - according to dramatic need and schedule. But no, it's a low budget film. We shoot whenever we have to shoot, and more importantly - the actors had to portray the age. How they carry themselves. Those details go a long way when they add up to twenty years of affection... it's an accumulation of slices of life. So that part is actually a lot harder to be accurate. But we were very careful about that. We made effort to make them - work.
Q. Were you worried at all about the accents?
AL : No I think he's very good about adapting accents - we have a great coach who would take the characters in real life and break it down and bring it to me and work with the actors...
Q. Were there any problems with getting the actors?
AL : We had to wait for Jake to finish promotion for The Day After Tomorrow so he wasn't there for the first week... I decided to go with younger actors who can play older so we could use that young innocence as an ingredient and carry on. I think they're good enough... rather to go with good young actors, like in early twenties. I think these two are among the best in their age group and they very much wanted to do it and I thought Heath was great to carry that Western thing and Jake to play the opposite of Heath and create a very good couple. In terms of a romantic love story the chemistry I think is great. Not a hard decision at all.
JS: When I first started - that was without Ang - when he was not available and we were looking with other possible directors - there was probably a hint of that, but I have to say this was probably the easiest film we've ever had to cast. I mean, (seems baffled by the memory of it) it was weirdly simple. You know you would look at some material and screen some things for Ang and he responded to it immediately - to speak to Jake and... I think Heath (uncertainly) accepted the role without meeting? Or was that afterwards?
AL : Yeah I was told he was willing to fly to Taiwan - or Thailand or whatever - to meet me. So that means he really wanted to do it and I came back to meet him.
Q. Would it be fair to say you can't feel as much for their chemistry for each other as for their individual quality?
AL : I think Heath has more individual quality, I think... He has to be the anchor of the movie, even though it's two parts, er, a love story. Heath is more carrying the story and the none verbal aura and the Western disposition - I think Heath... Heath's the anchor.
Q. Do you feel the story is very much grounded in its location, or do you think it could have been made in the East?
AL : It could be. It wouldn't be as poignant and poetic... I just don't see it any other way... and I think that period of time she (Annie Proulx) set it in really helped the privacy of their feelings - the uniqueness. And therefore is a pure way of telling a love story. It's almost like the oldest love story, but it had the newest texture. New-found, so to speak, texture. So I very much treasure that and I think - yes, I don't see it any other way.
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